Amplification for congas

[Tuco]

Reinforcing your congas and reinforcing your bass guitar on the same speaker system may be like trying to mix oil and water.

Tend to agree with this . . . who knows, maybe it's possible. I'm not a bassist, never tried it, but seems like two different requirements.

Something to think about: are your drums really too quiet in the mix, or are you just having trouble hearing yourself play? Or both?

For me, it's always been about hearing myself play. I ended up with a small powered mixer for three mics and a floor wedge. From the mixer right next to me, I control eq, balance between the mics, and the level of my monitor. The house PA (if there is one) gets a mono out from the mixer. Long-term, I'd like to go with in-ear monitors. Saves the ears and let's you custom-mix the level of your drums relative to everyone else.

I think Manny has the right take on this. Sure, you can save a little with Behringer/Alesis/Phonic, but it's not going to sound as good as be as durable as Mackie/Yamaha/Allen & Heath. I personally don't think buying low-end gear is worth it. The last thing you want is a knob breaking off or a channel to crap out during a show. Nor will the sound be as clean. The small Mackie mixers, like the VLZ3 series, are solid and would be hard to beat for your application. Do you really need built-in effects? Probably not.

My favorite live percussion mic is the Electro-voice N/D468.

http://www.electrovoice.com/products/83.html

Fantastic clarity, better gain before feedback than almost anything else, small form factor. I've found these for $70 used, $ 115 new (open box). Many people use SM-57's with good results. On the high-end, Shure 98DS condensers. I tried the Audix D-series a couple of years ago, but just didn't like them.

Consider getting your drums off the floor (if that's where they are), and mic the bottom of the drums as well. Not up in the drum itself of course, but a few inches off to the side, on a pillow or a short stand. That will make a big difference in the low end. You may need to switch the phase on that channel, either by hitting the appropriate button on your mixer (if it has that option) or using an in-line adapter. Fewer mics and channels generate fewer costs/phase cancellations/headaches/cables/stands/general complexity.

I can't help you with an active monitor suggestion, but generally, I use the wisdom of the masses (reviews, ratings, forums) to separate the great from the mediocre and the abysmal, then save some green on gently used gear on Ebay or Craigslist. Bidslammer makes the whole eBay experience painless:

http://www.bidslammer.com.

For Craigslist, I often set up Google alert to automatically send me email or a text message when something of interest comes along. Using Google alerts, you can search surrounding cities as well. Often you can find top-shelf gear being unloaded because someone's situation has changed. Good luck!

[Tonio]

Hey Tuco, I hear that the 468 is great for percussion. I have the 408 (predecessor to 468), and its great. Nice and crisp, withe just enough low end.

Back to the OP's question. It doesn't sound like he wants a full "big" concert sound system? And yes even 6" "speakers can push 60hz. It may not be ground shaking, but its not a rock concert is it? Just something to supplement no? congas are in the range of 200-1khz, bass is 40hz(depending on string count and tuning) to about 800 ish. Most of the time you don't need 100 hz pushed eq wise for a FOH mix. You more or less want to accentuate the slaps and detail (1khz~5khz) in a busy mix.
With that in mind, even a coffee house gig a small system can suffice for most acoustic type stuff. Or are we talking outdoors, live aid?
IMO, you would need more amp/pa for congas more than bass any day of the week, unless we are refering to acoustic/standup bass.
On the big outdoors gigs, sure its hard to hear yourself, thats what monitors wedgdes are for. even then its hard to hear yourself-especially if you have a rock head balancing the FOH , because congas are not important -they want guitars But thats part of being a percussionist and live gigs.
But that does not appear to be what you want by your description.

Also, never , ever try to play lowder than you need just to to be heard. dynamics are imporrtant , but not to the point of just being heard. You will never win against any other instrument's volume, but thats not what is about.
You answered your own question. I f pain sets in you are overdoing it, technique aside.

T

[Tuco]

Some good points Tonio. I see you're in SD . . . lived down there for many years.

Firebrand, although I am humble amateur that plays as a hobby, I want to encourage you to not beat the hell of your body in an effort to get louder. Impact injuries can plague you for years. I got started on djembe and mangaged to permanently damage some finger joints with bad technique. Pain, bruising, etc. After months of healing, I learned my lesson--start slowly, play easy, and go for tone instead of volume. So you're on the right track--get some amplification. After all, drums are ancient instruments that have a natural acoustic level. Something will be damaged if you go beyond that, and it's probably not the drum.

[Whopbamboom]

Someone in this thread asked about cheap stuff like Behringer. I might suggest that you get what you pay for. I have seen quite a few negative comments online on Behringer stuff... seems that the general consensus isn't too good. Be careful what you shop for! Read user feedbacks, not just online magazine reviews that tend to push products.

[Firebrand]

I just saw Paoli Mejias do a set in Puerto Rico with ONE freaking mic grabbing his 4 congas, and it sounded great

I have 3 clip on mics on a Behringer Mixer running through a Behringer 400 watt powered speaker. They work good, but it would be nice to eliminate so much cabling and setting up if there is a microphone that can grab 3 to 4 congas all at once.

Are there are any multi directional mikes that are good for this? Even if the minimum I can have is 2, that would reduce my need of having to amplify each drum.

Any thoughts?

[pulse]

Are there are any multi directional mikes that are good for this? Even if the minimum I can have is 2, that would reduce my need of having to amplify each drum.

Electrovoice RE-55/PL9 might work great. Basically the same mike. Long out of production and hard to find, you can find them cheap if you look long and hard.

The other omni suggestion I have is a small diaphragm condenser. The least expensive new model I'd recommend is an Audiotechnica AT3032. You could get better quality for more money. Probably have to spend several times the price to get significantly better quality, but another similar quality omni condenser may happen to sound better on your congas.

The RE-55 is a wide frequency omni dynamic. A dynamic is more rugged than a condenser, but an RE-55 would be harder to replace. There are not many good dynamic omni mikes but there are lots of omni condenser models that might work.

I think an omni could sound much better than a directional mike. The possible problem live is the bleed, something else might very well get in the mike besides the congas.

As far as directional mikes, which still might come in handy in addition to omni if you can't get everything in the omni(s), I think Electrovoice ND/408 and ND/468 sound very good on congas. You can find good deals on these used pretty easily.

One more dynamic omni which could work is an EV 635A/B. But this has no bass. You can get a lot of bass from all the other mikes above though so they might work well together. The 635 is inexpensive used and easy to find.

Hope this helps,

Kirk