More guaguanco questions

[Mr. Furley]

Hello everyone!

On Jimmy Bosch's album "Salsa Dura", I noticed the first song, "La Cacharra" is labeled as a guaguanco. However, I don't hear any guaguanco rhythm in this song. Most of the song seems to be just regular tumbao...Does anyone that is familiar with this recording hear any guaguanco in there? Thanks!

[franc]

furley
i'm not familiar with the song. do you mean. you don't hear the zepia section on the congas?? or the three golpes?? which of the guaguanco do you mean?? my best, franc

[Mr. Furley]

I don't hear the sequence of open tones which to me, perhaps naively, is characteristic of guaguanco (or at least some version of it). In particular, I don't hear the tres golpes. What do you mean by the "zepia" section? I'm not familar with this term. Thanks for the response!

[ralph]

there probably just labeled guaguanco, maybe because of tempo, or because the original song was done in guaguanco format, this is not uncommon. It is not folkloric guaguanco as we know it. Or yambu, like in the case of Eddie Palmieri's, "Lindo Yambu"...

[Mr. Furley]

Thanks Ralph!

New Question:

I was listening to "Traicion" performed by Roberto Roena and the beginning starts off with a guaguanco rhythm. However, it seems that the two open tones of the tres golpes were falling on the 3 side of the clave, rather that the 2 side. Is this normal when guaguanco is incorporated into other song forms? Or am I not hearing it right?

Thanks!

[ralph]

It is common to here recording of even folkloric rumba, with the tres golpes pattern, on the clave as opposed to on the other side of the clave, which is prevalent nowadays. A good example of this is:
Festival In Havana: A Musical Time Capsule Of Havana Before The Revolution
CD (Milestone 9337), Released 1955; Re-Issued 2003
Not only is guaganco played in the manner you mention they also used son clave, and not rumba clave as we know it. For the most part earlier recordings of guaguanco, and especially if it is incorporated into salsa, will show the outdated way of playing.
Now, how did the tres golpes pattern, move to the other side, well i heard a story about some guys that were drinking and well you know the rest...don't quote me on that though

[ricky linn]

Hi
many pieces are labelled as a guaguanco as they have originally been in this style. I'd bet the song you are talking about is in a minor key which is very common for guaguanco and is a big giveaway that a salsa or son-montuno arrangement is based on a traditional guaguaco melody.There are many examples of this, I'm sure there is even one on A Toda Cuba Le Gusta by the afro cuban all stars.

Ricky

[Mr. Furley]

On Jimmy Bosch's album "Salsa Dura", I noticed the first song, "La Cacharra" is labeled as a guaguanco. However, I don't hear any guaguanco rhythm in this song. Most of the song seems to be just regular tumbao...Does anyone that is familiar with this recording hear any guaguanco in there? Thanks!

Well, funny thing happened...I got to ask Jimmy Bosch in person about the song. My special lady and I were at the Texas Salsa Congress in Houston last night to watch the performances and do a little dancing, and Jimmy Bosch just happened to be there selling and promoting his music. Anyway, he says the song starts off as guaguanco...and even started mimicing the rhythm vocally. I guess it's there, but my untrained ears doesn't hear it, yet. BY the way I picked up his newest album "El Avion de la Salsa". George Delgado plays congas on most the tracks. He does some pretty interesting stuff even when he's just playing tumbao...mixes it up nicely. Bobby Allende also plays on a coupl of tracks. Good album...excellent for dancing.

Also at the Congress,one of the performances was this kid Edwin Rivera(?), from the Bronx who played Bongos and danced exactly in sync while a video of Roberto Roena was played. On the video Ray Barreto was playing congas (there were other musicians too) and Roberto Roena was playing the Bongos with a pair of sticks and this kid, dressed like Roena with Afro, was playing the exact solo note for note as Roena was playing it. After the bongo solo. Roena starts dancing and the kid does the same exact steps...remarkable.