afro's by pearl - skins

Manufacturers, brands, skins, maintenance, stands, sticks, michrophones and other accessories for congueros can be discussed into this forum ...... leave your experience or express your doubts!

Postby Seb » Wed Apr 23, 2003 7:46 am

Hello everyone! I have a set of Afro's elite by Pearl, I have a annoying little problem I have used the new NUSKYN by Remo thier awsome and have so much of a very natural sound but when it comes to my quinto the skins don't fit right so when I go to tune the drum up after awhile the rim (inside the skin) starts to seperate from the ring it's odd but it has happened once and now the new one I bought is starting to happen also ! what ideas do you guy's have for me thanks Iam new to this Board ! thanks sebastian ;)
User avatar
Seb
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2003 3:31 am

Postby Raymond » Wed Apr 23, 2003 5:53 pm

Remo's Nu Skyn head rim sits very low. I cannot get it from your post if the head broke or not, or if the head rim came out of the "skin". I have Nu Skyns in one of my bongos and I noticed that when I was tuning them appear that the rim was going to come out through the "glued" part of the folding but it did not. (Be aware some synthetic heads fit more comfortably in some specific brands and/or models. With some brands/models, although recommended by the manufacturer of the head, you have to play with the head.

If you continue to get problems, since Afro is no longer produced by Pearl and is now Pearl Percussion, go to Pearl's Drummer's Forum in the General Hand Percussion area and ask Glen Caruba, the forum's moderator. He has stated in the forum that he uses Nu Skyns and perhaps give you what is the right Nu Skyn head to use.

Saludos!
Raymond
 
Posts: 747
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2003 1:16 am
Location: Puerto Rico

Postby JohnnyConga » Thu Apr 24, 2003 2:29 pm

I am a Pearl Artist endorser...why would u put artificial skins on a "natural" instrument?...Artificial skin artificial sound!....My Pearl Elite congas sound great with the natural skins on them. And my new Fiberglass Pearls sound great too with the natural skin. So why put something artificial on something natural?...my 3 cents...At your Service..JC JOHNNY CONGA... ;)
User avatar
JohnnyConga
 
Posts: 3825
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 7:58 pm
Location: Ft. Lauderdale,Fl/Miami

Postby congabebe » Fri Apr 25, 2003 12:06 am

I have the Nuskyns on my Toca Premieres, they work but they don't fit right either. According to Remo, they are supposed to work. But they are a different ring size than the other remo Fiberskyn. It took for ever to get the thing to mount straight and when I run my finger under the comfort curve it does not have the same distance between the rim and the ring on the underside of the comfort curve. And I have to tighted down most of the hooks til the tuning nut is half way on threads on the hooks. Where as the other Fiberskins, the nut was near the last part of the hook. I wish I could put real skins on my congas but I would have to have special rings made and that is not in the cards right now. I will say that they sound better than the fiberskins, but I can't find a premounted head that is designed for my congas so I will have to wait.

As far as what you described on your quinto, it sounds like it is coming apart, and does not fit properly, maybe Glen Caruba can offer advise?

Good luck,
congabebe
User avatar
congabebe
 
Posts: 114
Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2002 2:46 am

Postby Michael S » Fri Apr 25, 2003 5:27 am

What the heck is an artificial sound?
User avatar
Michael S
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2002 1:32 am
Location: Northern Arizona

Postby JohnnyConga » Fri Apr 25, 2003 3:37 pm

A plastic head on an all "natural" instrument. Natural means real wood real skin. That is what it means to me. Put a artificial skin on a natural instrument gets an artificial sound to me. It is not the same .i am sorry....JC JOHNNY CONGA..
User avatar
JohnnyConga
 
Posts: 3825
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 7:58 pm
Location: Ft. Lauderdale,Fl/Miami

Postby Michael S » Fri Apr 25, 2003 4:10 pm

JC, I believe that you are only trying to describe a personal preference and, if so, ignore what I am saying. But if you are decrying the use of man-made, or "artificial", materials then I couldn't disagree with you more. Does an electric guitar produce an "artificial" sound and if it does, is it wrong. Does a trumpet (made of brass, a man-made alloy of copper & zinc) produce an artificial sound? I do not believe something is inherently better only because it appears naturally in nature.
One thing to be said for fibreglass drums with man-made heads: nothing had to die to produce it.
Sound is only the manipulation of air waves; playing a drum, any drum, is therefore an artificial, or man-made, manipulation of those air waves. Unless an acorn fell from a tree and landed on the drum head, the sound is man-made.
I believe there are more wooden drums than glass because the sound from a wood drum is more universally appealing to the drummers (not the listeners). But if someone makes a drum from man-made materials that most drummers like better than wood then the wood drum will be a museum piece. A matter of the simplest economics: supply & demand. Such as what happened to calf skins on kit drums. The ONLY reason you don't see them now is because more drummers than not preferred the plastic heads. The same could one day happen with congas. And don't you believe it couldn't.
User avatar
Michael S
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2002 1:32 am
Location: Northern Arizona

Postby yoni » Fri Apr 25, 2003 6:10 pm

Hey guys,

An interesting topic I also got into before here, but had more thoughts on it ...

I like the sound of natural heads and materials - with at least the head made of organic material (skin). The shell I like best when it is of organic or natural material (wood in congas and bongos, and clay and metal, as in doumbeks).

I think JC said artificial sound because those sounds are derived partly from artificial, synthetic materials (the other part being our hands). It's true you can make any material sound nice if you play it long enough, but there's an undeniable difference to me between the sounds of natural and artificial heads, period! And to me the naturals also feel better (good ones), just more "right" to me.

I have some drums with synthetic heads and use them at times. They do last way longer and cut through sonically. But there sure is that difference, in sound and touch. There's nothing like the tone of a natural head to me, no way. The substance is just impossible to duplicate by man, and its amazing complexity, plus maybe the very fact that the skin was alive, all make for a sound that I find supreme.

My pops made an instrument that became a museum piece. It's an electric guitar made of a skeletal-like steel structure and is in a few museums now. He played with his fingers, which I find gives a "warmer" sound than with a pick, and was quite into that steel guitar for some years, and made it sound wild. But he eventually tired of the feel of the thing - stainless steel is cold, and he went back to building minimalist wood electric guitars in his apartment, without the help and trouble of "big business" (he got in a bad deal over mass-production the steel guitar, wasn't built to proper specs., etc.). He eventually laughed it off and said: "That's where the thing belongs, in museums. It's great to look at but cold to touch."

There I go, way off topic again. I can like all kinds of sounds from all kinds of materials. Electric sounds can be great and are unattainable by acoustic instruments (and vice versa), but somehow I do ultimately prefer acoustic sound, same for natural heads over synthetic... just a matter of taste.

As someone else here says, my 2 cents.
yoni
 
Posts: 538
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2003 12:52 pm
Location: Israel

Postby Simon B » Fri Apr 25, 2003 7:26 pm

I'm going to stick my neck out, so here goes!

With regard to the conga drum, for me wood and natural skin are intrinsically superior to man-made substances. I think the sound is also better, but even if it wern't, I would still prefer to use natural materials. Like you say Yoni, I really dig the fact that the skin was at one point alive - that kind of pre-modern connection is important to me, call it mysticism if you will. I think the hand drum is a potent symbol of connection between the here and the then, unlke the electric guitar or the saxophone, which really are modern inventions. Now admittedly I could go further and play a more folkloric drum - ditching my Meinls for sure, with their metal fittings and mass-production. What prevents me is price and to some extent practicality. It's a balancing act. A parallel - I tend to buy organic meat from a butchers rather than the super-market mass-produced, shrink-wrapped variety. But I wouldn't follow it to the extreme and start refusing to wear sneakers because they are made out of rubber and plastic, or living in a shack in the woods like Henry Thoreau!

It's the little gestures that count. And for me they include playing with a natural skin encased in real wood!

Simon B
Simon B
 
Posts: 316
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 8:17 pm

Postby Michael S » Fri Apr 25, 2003 9:13 pm

Really? Well, tonight I'm gonna go hunt down and kill some x-rays so I can get some new skins for my bongos.
User avatar
Michael S
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2002 1:32 am
Location: Northern Arizona

Postby JohnnyConga » Sat Apr 26, 2003 12:37 am

I love a healthy discussion,don't you?......I got to cop to the fact that I do have x-ray film on my macho bongo. Now I didn't put it on that's is the way I got them. Now that "plastic" sound I have to admit lends itself to the bongo. I have even played on a conga with x-ray film but that really was bad news sound wise. I have tried the Evans but I have yet to try the Nuskyns on congas yet. I did try some toca fiberglass but they sounded like garbage cans to me,too boomy for my taste. I guess that's what it kinda boils down to huh, Michael S?.....Sabor!.........At your Service...JC JOHNNY CONGA.... ;)
User avatar
JohnnyConga
 
Posts: 3825
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 7:58 pm
Location: Ft. Lauderdale,Fl/Miami

Postby JohnnyConga » Sat Apr 26, 2003 12:44 am

I'm like "old skool" and a "traditionalist", now here is where I contradict myself. I played fiberglass congas for most of my career. But that was so I could be heard. In my day believe it or not I grew up playing without a mic,and that is one reason why i play hard to this day even with being mic'd. Then I rediscovered wooden congas again when I got my Pearl Elites and fell in love with the sound all over. Now I am going back to fiberglass because I need a brighter sound with the latin bands I sit in with, and my woods I use in different musical scenarios. I need to feel "skin on skin", my skin texture does not allow me to "feeL" an artificial conga head. but hey that's me :D .................JC JOHNNY CONGA....PS I will be appearing at my first World Rhythm Festival here in Seattle, it starts tonight and ends sunday night. I will be there all day tomorrow with my workshop at 4pm......... ;)
User avatar
JohnnyConga
 
Posts: 3825
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 7:58 pm
Location: Ft. Lauderdale,Fl/Miami

Postby Michael S » Sat Apr 26, 2003 3:34 am

You said it all Johnny; it all boils down to getting the sound you're looking for. And sometimes it is NOT the sound you prefer but it IS the sound that is needed for the job, as any record producer will tell you. ;)
User avatar
Michael S
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2002 1:32 am
Location: Northern Arizona

Postby yoni » Sat Apr 26, 2003 1:28 pm

Hi again all,

Michael, where I live there's a lot of musicians in a small area so if I'm hired for a recording it's because the producer or someone else prefers "my" sound, or the sound I prefer. These days in the studio all sounds can be altered "downstream" anyway, to the producer's or someone else's liking.

I think Johnny has an interesting point about the brightness of the synthetic sound lending itself to the macho bongo, the "violin" of the latin percussion section which needs to cut through. I have the Remo Nuskyn on mine at the moment, as I said in this discussion on the bongo forum. The natural ones sound about as crisp, and better to me, when they're really tight, but this causes them to break often and it's expensive to keep replacing them. So I admit, my Nuskyn on the macho is sort of a compromise for now.

As mentioned already here by others and myself, the synthetic materials, head or shell, are great for cutting through in many live situations. In recording or acoustic type situations I still like the sound and feel of the naturals.

I'll repeat here the little wise-crack I stuck in the bongo forum:

I don't want to rate a drum with a woman, but when you make love what would you prefer - the real thing or a rubber doll?

On my macho bongo, that Nuskyn sound comes close, but plastic generally feels and sounds like plastic.



Edited By yoni on April 26 2003 at 17:00
yoni
 
Posts: 538
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2003 12:52 pm
Location: Israel

Postby Michael S » Sat Apr 26, 2003 5:41 pm

Look, this is not rocket science here. The simple point I was trying to make is: Suppose you want that plastic sound? Then whatever gives you that plastic sound is "THE ABSOLUTE BEST THING YOU CAN PUT ON YOUR DRUM!" Sound is sound and it is not artificial. It is as real and as individual as the person hearing it.
Let's all go back and review the original topic; Seb had no problem with the sound of his synthetic heads on his drums. In fact, he said the sound was "awsome" and "natural". His only problem was with the way they mount. And then someone questioned his sound, WITHOUT ACTUALLY HEARING IT, simply because the heads were "artificial" when that person has stated himself, in other posts, that he has used, and still uses, synthetic heads himself. To me, this sounded not only hypocritical but like the wholesale condemnation of synthetic materials simply because they were not natural and it is to this I objected.
There is nothing natural about a trumpet except the sound, one of the most beautiful in the world, yet it is made of brass (a man-made alloy), steel (a man-made alloy), felt (seen any felt bushes lately?) and maybe some plastic or teflon.
All boiled down: it is simply personal preference. I think we can all agree on that?
I'm outta here.
User avatar
Michael S
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2002 1:32 am
Location: Northern Arizona

Next

Return to CongaSet and accessories

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 27 guests